If you follow us on Twitter, you know we're not fans of Seth Davis. I guess that's fair since he's not a fan of the topic we cover- Purdue sports.
It's one thing to not like Purdue and give good, solid analytical reasoning for why you think that. It's quite another to mercilessly-pound an idea with nothing as your defense other than opinion. Davis does this over and over again...and he's wrong a lot. CBS doesn't seem to mind...but I do.
A few weeks ago when Purdue was in the top-10, Davis was asked who would be the first team out in that group. He of course answered Purdue. He went further to say that Purdue wouldn't get past the first weekend...without having any clue who Purdue would be playing. Let's look at Matty's tourney record, Seth- wait, nevermind, that'd take research...don't worry about it, I know it won't happen.
All season he's consistently had Purdue lower than where they've belonged and where they've landed in the poll. In fact, for much of the early season, he didn't rank Purdue. And once they had earned his good graces, they hung in the 20-24 range. Is it because they hadn't played anybody at that point? Could be. But, that very situation didn't stop him from ranking his beloved Blue Devils consistently in the top-5.
Davis has a problem with Purdue-I guess because Purdue beat Duke in Alaska a decade ago (I can't think of another reason). Whatever the reason really doesn't matter, but the proof's in the pudding and we have plenty of rancid dairy dessert all around the interwebnet with Davis' pasty fingerprints all over it.
Most-recently, he penned an article about 54 potential NBA players that are currently in college and what NBA scouts think of them. The problem is, he has no specific scout's opinion. Instead, he sites "several scouts" as his source...and he refuses to tell us who they are, so they can stay anonymous.
Sweet.
It's a nice place to be- you write an opinion-based piece, with your name attached, and you have no culpability. This type of pseudo-journalism is a pet peeve of ours at this site. But, let's take a look at our favorite guys in this article: Of course, JaJuan Johnson and E'Twaun Moore.
JaJuan Johnson, 6-10 senior center, Purdue
Some people really like him, but I just don't know how he gets his game off. I don't think his post game will transfer, so you're looking at a 6-10 jump shooter who will have a hard time guarding any positions in our league. He strikes me as a combination of Marcus Camby and Hakim Warrick. I'd say he's on the bubble for the first round. I think he makes the league, but he won't get a lot of scratch.
Honestly, I don't even know what the first sentence means...so I won't spend a ton of time on it. I guess he's saying he doesn't understand how well Johnson will play in the league. He jibbers his way through the review of JJ, saying little and comparing 25 to a guy who is a rebound-first player who's been in the league for 14 seasons (doesn't sound like a bad investment for an NBA team...but JJ is far from a banger on the boards) and Hakim Warrick, who while a few inches shorter is a very-similar player, statistically, as he left college. But, Warrick was more of a combo player and JJ will more than likely never play shooting forward in the NBA. Davis ends the write-up by saying he won't "get a lot of scratch". Once again, not exactly sure what he means, but I don't think it's a positive.
So, let's compare JJ to a few of the guys, that he's played against, that Davis' imaginary...I mean...anonymous sources are really high on.
Sullinger- "I love him."
He's good, he's young...a lot to like there. When JJ faced him, here's how it went:
Player Pts. Reb. Blk.
Sullinger 17 7 0
Johnson 22 7 0
I guess JJ's game did kinda "get off" in that contest...let's try another.
Benson- "I like him."
It's not love, but it's definitely more positive than his review of JJ.
Player Pts. Reb. Blk.
Benson 16 14 2
Johnson 25 11 2
Not too shabby...JJ also added 5 assists. Benson had 0.
Next, John Leuer- "He's more skilled than you think."
Player Pts. Reb. Blk.
Leuer 24 13 0
Johnson 23 4 3
Once again, JJ did OK, I guess.
Now onto Smooge's review:
E'Twaun Moore, 6-4 senior guard, Purdue
I think someone will take him in the second round. He's small and not very athletic, so that's a bad combination, but the kid has found a way to get it done at a high level. But again, who is he? What does he bring to the table? He can get to the basket at the college level, but he doesn't shoot it great. He reminds me of Reece Gaines, who didn't make it in the league because he had no position. Or Joe Forte from North Carolina. Forte was better than Moore in college, but he didn't make it in the NBA.
I think Moore will have a fight to be successful in the league because he is shorter and he doesn't appear to be quite as quick as many of the guys playing shooting guard in the NBA. So I understand some of the criticism. But the line that really bothers me is this: "But again, who is he?"
Here's who he is: He's a guy who's led his team in scoring for three of his four seasons. He's All-Big Ten, an Academic All-American, an Honorable Mention All-American and a lockdown defender.
Unlike JJ who's squared off against quite a few future draft prospects, I could only find one on the list that Moore had faced- Duke's Nolan Smith.
Davis said of Smith,
Okie doke. Smith's career numbers look like this: 12.7 pts. 2.7 ast. 2.7 reb."Can he make it as a two guard? That's the question. I'm not sure he has the kind of speed and quickness to be able to attack guys. I think he's proven enough to be drafted and he'll figure it out once he gets up there."
Moore: 15.0 pts 2.8 ast. 4.4 reb.
But Smith played in the tough ACC while Moore played in the lowly BT, right? Yeah, and Smith never had any talent around him at Duke while Moore was always surrounded by some of the best teams in America. Oh wait...I thought Purdue was only a two-man team. Nevermind.
Then head-to-head, Smith must have just owned Smooge, right??
Player Pts. Reb. Ast. Stl.
Smith 15 5 4 0
Moore 18 4 1 2
Alright, maybe not. It just seems odd that Moore is too small at 6'4", but Smith at 6'2" is not. And Moore is not athletic, but Smith, who will be drafted to a position he doesn't play in college deserves a chance to "figure it out" on the next level.
Other interesting tidbits:
Singler- "I'm a Singler guy all the way."
Plumlee- "If you stick around, you're going to get better."
(If I didn't know better, I'd think that was a plea...not a review.)
And if you really wanna pick this piece apart, read some of the UNC player reviews.
I know, supposedly these words weren't even Davis'...but since he's the only real person I can find mentioned as responsible for the article, I'll pin it on him. I guess if nothing else, Davis is consistent.
Consistently awful.
19 comments:
My God , you guys are defensive !!
You cry sour grapes , when in fact , we have been tossed around in the sweet sixteen and rd of 32 the last three years even with supposedly amazing talent. Let Davis spew his words and hope to make him wrong . At this point, sadly,he's not .
Oh and comparing JJ to Sullinger in a game that was over in 10 minutes is really ridiculous . It was ALL garbage time...
Duke gets a pass on top 5 because they JUST WON the Nat'l Championship !! Get over it and write about all the goings on of the biggest week of the year so far !!
GO BOILERS
Come on Seth, using an alias such as Boilerbink is not really gallant. Step up and use your name when you post.
I must be missing something with the Carolina comment? He didn't really praise Harrison Barnes, and he basically said Tyler Zeller sucks?
Oh, no he didn't!
I don't even know where to begin. I mean, Seth has never really shocked me with his sheer lack of k-nowledge regarding real talent or entertaining basketball, but ... wow. E'Twaun is "small and not very athletic" ??? I guess he didn't have access to Google when he wrote his article under a rock on Somalia. You don't just ACCIDENTALLY finish your career at Purdue University as a four-year starter, scoring 2,000 pts, netting 500 boards and (what was the other stat, assists?) 300 dimes... or maybe in Seth's Wonderland you can.
I really hope that E'Twaun and JJ see this before they play this week, and get very, very mad. They're fun to watch when they are angry.
I am also not a big Davis, and this article was definitely not a good one. Saying "Who is he?" about E'Twaun shows his ignorance. There are several guys on that list who are much more uncommon to the casual fan than he.
However, the stuff about Davis' rankings of Purdue surprised me, so I went and looked it up which you can do at pollspeak.com. Here are his rankings of Purdue for the first 15 weeks of the season, with Purdue's actual ranking that week subtracted from Seth's ranking in parentheses: 11(-3), 12(-2), 9(-1), 20(-2), 21(+2), 20(+1), 17(+3), 18(+6), 18(+7), 14(+6), 18(+4), 16(+4), 14(+3), 16(+2), 13(+2).
You can see that Seth was actually ranking us higher than the other voters early in the season, then things changed shortly after the Richmond loss, and he has ranked us consistently below the other voters. However, we were always in his top 25, and the lowest we got was 21 in his poll, which was still only 2 spots behind the actual poll. During Purdue's lowest week, when they were 22, Seth actually had us at 20.
So, while I will agree some of his articles and things he says on TV make me vomit in my mouth sometimes, he hasn't been too terribly far off in ranking Purdue.
I still can't get over the E'twaun is too small and not very athletic line. Give me a break. Smooge dunks when you don't even expect it.
The lines in the JJ analysis don't make sense to me either. maybe not getting a scratch is something good. maybe seth uses it interchangably with itch and I wouldn't want to get an itch if I was JJ.
I didn't read his Zeller analysis but he looked like one of the best players in the Duke vs. UNC game.
Add Doug Gottlieb and Dana O'Neil from ESPN to the list of haters.
It's always great when we write articles that we back up with statistics and legit comparisons...and then get told we're "defensive." Solid comment.
We write about Purdue and we bleed black and gold. We've been doing it this way for going on five years.
I agree Boilerbink, Boilerdowd did get a little 'defensive'. Some other descriptors that come to mind when reading this post include 'raving lunatic' and 'off his meds'.
These boys have been off their meds for going on five years now.
As for Davis, I quit listening to guys like him years ago. But until Matty gets the team to the Final Four, this is what we can expect to get.
I don't understand how you can compare jj's performance to sullinger's in a game where osu was up 20 and Dillinger took all of 12 shots and played 25 minutes.
Sullinger (damn iPhone auto correct)
Sullinger (damn iPhone auto correct)
Personally, I think I like Dillinger better. Makes him sound like a gigantic pickle.
I think I speak for most of us when I say that we prefer b-dowd and J without their meds. They're most entertaining when they're off them.
While I couldn't agree with you more Boilerdowd...honestly, it's Seth Davis. I'd sooner chew shards of salted glass than get my panties in a wad over that half-wit. A blind squirrel could type a word every now and then. And sometimes editors pay people to write drivel. It shouldn't be that way but it is. I'm not going to lose any sleep over Seth Davis. However, Wiscy and the Bucknuts at Mackey this week...well that's enough to keep my mind busy this week anyway.
Incidentally, if I hear one more commenter note that Sullinger is a better player-of-the-year candidate than JJ and cites Sullinger being the go-to-guy for the game winning shot against Penn State, I'm going to lose my mind.
Let's examine our NCAA record the last four years a little closer:
1. we usually get hosed on location and probably on actual seed
2. we always are underdogs, yet win at least one "upset"
3. our most complete team yet (last years) was incredibly hobbled for reasons i don't need to go into.
So, yes they're (as I am) defensive. But I feel like someone needs to be to bring the overall image we have nationally back to a resemblance of reality.
JJ and Smooge are great players, and I look forward to them proving a lot of people, like Douche Davis, wrong. They're used to it.
You realize that these are not quotes from Seth Davis but are quotes from the scouts who he talked to, right? Did you even read the beginning of the article? Here is what it says:
"Finch, you see, is an NBA scout. Only, he's not just one scout, he's several scouts rolled into one, an amalgam of conversations I've had with five NBA scouts over the last week to get their assessments of 56 college players who could be available in this year's NBA draft. Since NBA scouts are not permitted to be quoted talking about underclassmen, I granted my scouts anonymity so they could be candid. Then I combined their quotes together to sound like it came from one person, an invented character named Finch." So I understand that you might not like Seth Davis, but at least get the facts straight.
Mathew- did you read my post?
Right ... Hence the "imaginary friend".... which mysteriously mirrors Seth Davis' normal opinions. :)
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